„I inherited the Flying Circus -
and learnt to love it!“
The operation of customised digital applications with high demands on flexibility, stability and availability - and maximum integration and cooperation between Development and Operations: this is how we at Flying Circus see our DevOps-as-a-Service offering. But how do others see us? Dirk Fangohr is Managing Director of riscLOG Solution, which has been offering market-leading software solutions for online claims management for handling transport and goods claims for more than 20 years. As the business model is largely based on digital solutions, reliable and trouble-free access is a top priority for customers.
‘riscLOG - Top software for the logistics industry made in Lübeck’ is written on your website. What does that mean?
Dirk Fangohr: We have focussed on claims management in the logistics industry. Since 2002, we have been positioned as a digital platform that enables the various participants to organise their logistics process and handle claims. This has become very well established. We started with a system co-operation. There are about two handfuls of these in Germany. Almost all of them are now under contract with us and we cover a large part of the market with our platform. Our main product is called ClaimX. This means that we are not only active in German-speaking countries, but also with our customers throughout Europe and indeed the whole world.
The Flying Circus plays an important role in the operation of riscLOG applications. How long have you been working together?
Christian Theune: We actually have a very close partnership with riscLOG and a very individualised constellation. However, this may not sound unusual for us at first, because we basically always operate individual applications. Our partnership with riscLOG really goes back a long way. I think the first contact must have been in 2003, 2004. However, at that time we were still travelling with our company gocept and were one of the first in Germany to offer development work with the Python programming language - in other words, we worked on the riscLog product as consultants and developers; and gradually also provided support during operation.
Today, we are doing exactly that, which is why we spun off the Flying Circus in 2015: We assume significant responsibility for operations, ensuring that the riscLOG development team can concentrate on the continuous further development of the software, while we ensure that changes and additions are delivered to the servers in such a way that riscLOG customers are not impaired or even disrupted in their use of the platform. And of course the basis for all this is that the servers are running - the show must always go on - and that the high quality criteria in terms of security and availability are always met.
Due to the many years of cooperation, riscLOG also has operations expertise, so that there does not have to be a 100 per cent separation here and certain things in the day-to-day business are handled by riscLOG, but always with the possibility of intervening in depth in the Flying Circus.
On the other hand, riscLOG not only benefits from the fact that we have known the software side of the application very well for many years, but that we can also look at it with developer glasses, so to speak - but today from a focussed operations perspective. So we can really play ping-pong at an absolutely high level and cooperate so profitably.
Are there any particular challenges when working with riscLOG?
Christian Theune: The logistics and insurance industry has very clear regulations and high requirements in terms of data protection, security and processes. This is a particular challenge for us and has spurred and driven us on to make many further developments over the years. Due to the requirement for our own hardware, our virtualised platform for riscLOG has to run in its own instance, unlike other customers who use our public cloud offering across the board.
Dirk, you inherited the collaboration with the Flying Circus from your predecessor when you joined riscLOG in 2017. How did that go from your perspective?
Dirk Fangohr: I bought riscLOG as part of a company succession. The Python world in which we operate here was something completely new to me. I originally came from a traditional consulting background and had had relatively little contact with it up until then. And so I inherited the Flying Circus - and learnt to love it! The transition was seamless. You are doing a very good job.
Do you have an example of how you have tackled and managed change together?
Dirk Fangohr: Change is our constant companion. In 2002, digital applications were developed very differently than they are today - the ClaimX platform, for example, was based on an application stack that was more in the direction of a framework. Corresponding dialogues and processes were then programmed within this. However, the world has moved on since then. Today, we need smaller, more dynamic software packages, you could also say application packages and packets that can be easily managed and scaled during operation. Even if it was a necessary evil to work through the IT mistakes of the past and put them on a modern, contemporary footing: This transition from a large framework to small, interlocking packages was a central and also long-term reorganisation for us.
What role did the Flying Circus play in this?
Dirk Fangohr: There were a lot of thick boards involved. And we're actually still drilling, so we're not quite through with the conversion yet. We managed to get through the biggest chunk, which is particularly important for operations - ultimately also thanks to the power of persuasion and, of course, the active support of the Flying Circus. In many places, it was really about long-established beliefs, sometimes myths. For example, during my time as a consultant, I learnt that large databases only run on good hardware. The Flying Circus took the sting out of that and told us: ‘Guys, it works just as well virtualised as on a hardware machine.’ But it was still a long way from there. Our database is large and essential for the application to work. Even after we embraced the idea of the conversion, the big challenge was the preparatory testing. How can we stress the database in order to have really reliable figures? And will our 400 GB database actually still work efficiently?
Christian Theune: That's a very good example! Above all, it's about the people involved in addition to all the technical details. And the change at riscLOG in 2017 simply broke things open. We simply had to build new relationships. And along the way, we once again saw - and seized - the opportunity to really put such major topics on the agenda. Incidentally, we don't just bring up a topic like the database and the associated new architectural approach. Rather, we were convinced that many limitations and problems would simply disappear if we pursued the virtualised approach. We also knew that virtualisation would be different. Certain aspects of the database query may be slower at first glance, but the system can do more overall. Individual problems can then be solved successively once the foundations have been laid. And you will have gained a lot in the long term.
olving such a complex problem requires the right approach. Dirk, how do you perceive the Flying Circus' ability to solve complex problems?
Dirk Fangohr: I think I can categorise this well with my 30 years of IT expertise. I've had the honour of working with very good and large teams. But when it comes to the Flying Circus, I'm tempted to make this statement: it's really impressive how far and how deeply the knowledge is anchored. I can't remember a single firefighting operation - where the pressure is particularly high and good solutions are needed quickly - where the Flying Circus didn't have a solution ready. Customers must be able to rely on riscLOG. And we can simply rely on the Flying Circus because they have the necessary expertise. And to add to that: Because the Flying Circus is not just a passive service provider that processes tickets, but proactively thinks along with us, provides high-calibre consulting and in some cases even brings in a supervisory and management perspective, we have certainly prevented the vast majority of firefighting operations together.
Partnership-based collaboration is a top priority at the Flying Circus. How does that work for you at riscLOG?
Dirk Fangohr: Acceptance between professionals is incredibly important. You have to be able to throw the ball to each other and know that you are playing at eye level. It's not so much about simply getting something placed. It's about exchanging ideas with the other person. Consulting is the magic word here: moderating problems and ultimately finding solutions. This is only possible through dialogue. One person asks the right questions and then the other realises: "Right! I haven't even checked that yet." Acceptance and expertise go hand in hand here.
Christian Theune: This also includes addressing pain points. It can happen that things grate. And to overcome this, you simply need trust. If everything the other person does is always questioned, you can't find a solution. You have to realise that you are heading towards a common goal.
Dirk Fangohr: But, dear Theuni, that's the case in every marriage, isn't it?
Christian Theune: Yes, exactly!
Penultimate question: Dirk, how likely is it that you will recommend the Flying Circus to others? 0 is extremely unlikely, 10 is extremely likely.
Dirk Fangohr: 9! Very, very likely!
Now, the entire conversation has been very appreciative, especially about the Flying Circus. At the end, let's talk briefly about the fact that it can't be a coincidence that riscLOG has been so successful for so long. Why is that?
Christian Theune: They have managed to maintain and develop a software product for over 20 years that is as good yesterday as it is today, despite all the uncertainty involved! So, when it comes to predicting which architectures, features, innovation topics, processes, technologies and so on will be relevant tomorrow, they manage to find a good balance: on the one hand, preserving the successful parts and, on the other, having the courage and strength to develop the product further in the right place, quickly recognising any undesirable developments and changing direction. The speed of innovation is just right! It is very unusual for someone to do something so consistently over such a long period of time. Often, our suggestions don't get enough attention from other customers and projects for someone to follow them up before they become urgent or even catch fire.
Thank you very much for the interview!
Christian Theune: Thank you too!
Dirk Fangohr: Gladly again.